Thursday, December 18, 2008

McCain still doesn't get it

After 'one heck of a ride,' McCain is moving ahead
"I still think comprehensive immigration reform is very necessary," McCain said.

"If President Obama wants it to be a highest priority, I'm prepared to join in," McCain said. "If not, I'm not going to go out there, out front, because it's obvious it won't succeed unless we get the administration in the lead."

"If somebody's been here for a long period of time and been good citizens, they've worked hard in their community and at their job — look, it's reality and there's not 12 million pairs of handcuffs in America," he said.

We also can't arrest 12 million burglars, drunk drivers or rapists at the same time but we can arrest them when we catch them. It's actually even easier to deal with the illegal aliens because we can deny them things like employment with relative ease.


Kaelri said...

You're forgetting - sometimes willfully, I think - that the vast majority of illegal residents aren't burglars, drunk drivers or rapists. The practical reality that people who keep their heads down, do a good job at whatever work they've found, and don't commit any further crimes are extremely difficult to filter out. One, sure. A small conspiracy, I'm sure the FBI could manage. 4% of the entire population? Not a chance.

Any solution to the problem, and I certainly agree it's a problem, has to be systemic. It's more than just a law enforcement issue and it isn't productive to treat it like one.

DAVE01 said...

Kaelri, all the criminal aliens are criminals. First, it may simply be a civil violation for the FIRST illegal entry into our country, but is a felony for the SECOND illegal entry. Second, if the criminal aliens are working and not paying taxes, this is a felony (can you say Al Capone). Third, if they work with some other person's SSN, that is also a felony.

I like your phrase:
don't commit any further crimes are extremely difficult to filter out.

So, some crimes are OK? At what point are crimes are not OK? Who gets to decide which and how many of those crimes are OK? I rape OK for these people? Is murder OK for these people? Is robbery OK? Will you personally pay for the initial crimes by these people? If not, why?

The systemic solution is to stop all aid to these people. Education, medication and anything else. Incarceration in something like Sheriff Arapaio's jail for the people who commit additional crimes would be acceptable. For the people from the western hemisphere, the only help that they should receive is a swift train ride (in a cattle car) to the southern tip of their home country. Any emergency medical needs should be provided by or charged to their home countries. For the people from other continents, a slow boat ride to the least inhabitable place in their home countries. This may make them think twice about BREAKING OUR LAWS AGAIN!

You are right that it is more than just a law enforcement issue. It is a national survival issue and should be treated as such. It is a massive crime issue. It is an health issue. It is an education issue. It is a ten year old girl getting raped and murdered issue. It is the issue where kids are killed in Minnesota by a drunk driver issue.

People need to come here LEGALLY. If they don't, give them a swift boot. We are a nation of laws. You probably did not learn that in school. That is what makes us special.

It is an issue where the schools are being dumbed down to the lowest common denominator where vast sums are being spent on children who aren't supposed to be here in the first place and our own children are suffering. Where are our childrens' rights to LIFE, LIBERTY AND THE PURSUIT OF HAPPINESS?

DAVE01 said...

Kaelri, if a rapist just rapes once and does not commit further crimes and is extremely difficult to filter out, should law enforcement just drop the investigation? If a murderer just murders once and does not commit further crimes and is extremely difficult to filter out, should law enforcement just drop the investigation?

If one of your children (if you have any) or a close family member was raped and murdered like Dani Countryman and the rapist/murderer did not commit further crimes and was extremely difficult to filter out, would you be OK with law enforcement just ignoring the crimes? Why don't you imagine just such a scenario. Imagine going to the morgue to identify your family member and just imagine telling yourself that basically the rapist/murderer was keeping his head down, doing a good job and won't commit further crimes. Now imagine you find out this has happened before with the same rapist/murderer and law enforcement just dropped it because it was extremely difficult to filter out.
Would that not be ironic?

Anonymous said...

MOST illegal aliens DO pay taxes and contribute to the social security pot. MOST do not use a fake social security number, but rather a tax ID number. MOST do not commit crimes beyond their illegal entry.

Dave 01 -- Only following your "all or nothing" logic trail here: if one of your children or your entire family were mowed down by some nut who bought a super assualt weapon at a trade show -- no questions asked -- would you THEN and only then have some sort of epiphany that at least SOME gun control might be a good idea?

You use extreme examples of crimes to paint a whole group of people with a very big brush. The fact is, and you KNOW it, that the vast, vast majority of illegal immigrants do not commit crimes beyond the crime of being here illegally.

Anonymous said...

McCain said : "If somebody's been here for a long period of time and been good citizens ..."

A US Senator who doesn't know what a citizen is. Sad.

Anonymous said...

Anon 951
you said if there only crime is being here illegally whats wrong with that! If they are working how are they paying taxes or under whos ssn are they paying taxes . So if they are working and not paying taxes or useing someone elses ssn , are they not breaking the law . Send them home when caught , and fine the people that knowingly hire them to high heaven ( maby even put the owners in jail with them!!)

Bobkatt said...

Part of this supposed "systemic solution" includes educating the do-nothing types to the tremendous damage to this country illegal immigration poses. Hence the genesis of this blog.
Why is it that most of the same people that think we can't solve illegal immigration believe that we can have a tremendous effect on the climate by swapping carbon credits or changing light bulbs??
Why is it that the same people that bemoan that there is never enough money for schools don't seem to mind that we over crowd the classrooms with students that don't belong here?
Why is it that the same people that bemoan the lack of health care insist that we must also provide health care for the rest of the world?
Why is it that the same people that insist that most illegals don't commit further crimes willfully subvert Jamiel's Law that would allow L.A. police to deport known gang banger illegal aliens?
Why is it that the same people that say that the law should punish the employer instead of the illegal are now suing to overturn Columbia Counties enforcement employers?
Why is it that the same people that fret over over crowding, pollution, urban sprawl, too many cars, and the decline of natural resources don't seem to mind doubling our population in 20 years?
Why is it that I could go on forever?

Bobkatt said...

On McCain's comment that there aren't 12 million pairs of handcuffs in America.
Let's make sure that there are enough for the real criminals such as Bush and his cronies, Paulson, Dodd, Frank and the rest of the Congress traitors.

Anonymous said...

McCain, another elite too long in power US Senator whom does not know what us regular people need, he is doing what his Millionaire wife needs for Cheap labor to work in her Beer factory.

Over 2 Million out of work this year and our "leaders" can dare too say, we need foreign labor instead of Americans working at those jobs that are left, Disgusting.

How do you apologists accept over 1.6 million Legal and another 2 Million ILLEGAL immigrants coming here every year that need a Job, Health care, Education, House, Car, etc.

Why do you dare to say this is OK and WE should be competing for money with 3rd worlders thrilled to get min. wage?

How can you ignore the Job losses, 1 in 5 here on Food stamps now, unemployment over 8% and Government wants to raise every Fee & Tax there is to PAY for all the "needy", whom woouldn't be "needy" if we were on a level and legal playing field.

E-Verfiy = No Jobs for Illegals = Americans work and pay all Taxes & Economy get much better.

Illegals pay Taxes? Only a little S.S. and then via EITC & Child credit, get more BACK than paid in, check out recent Greely Co. report for Proof.


Anonymous said...

Nobody said illegal immigration or the problems caused by it are "OK". Kaelri didn't and neither did Anon 951. But it is also not "OK" to use false or fabricated or completely exagerated information to advance an agenda.

Significant numbers of illegal immigrants are going home on their own because all the new legislation to send them home is working anyway, that coupled with the economic situation...

DAVE01 said...

Anon 9:51 AM
These extreme examples are happening every day everywhere in this country. You must have been on Mars for the last few years to miss that fact.

Are you telling me that the lettuce pickers pay their share in taxes. Facts have shown that for every dollar they pay in taxes (I agree some do pay taxes), they take back three dollars in services. Yes, I'm using extreme examples. However, how would you explain to Dani Countryman's family (or any other raped and murdered child) that what happened to their child (or any other family member), the rape and murder was just the cost of going business? Our governments first job is to protect us. All of us.

If these are such wonderful people, why is 17% of the federal prison population (the ones run by the Federal Bureau of Prisons, not the private ones) mexicans? You may not like the truth and the facts, but that is the way it is.

Answer these questions:
So, some crimes are OK? At what point are crimes are not OK? Who gets to decide which and how many of those crimes are OK? Is rape OK for these people? Is murder OK for these people? Is robbery OK?
Again, we are a nation of laws. God bless our founding fathers and their wisdom.

How many more people can we absorb into our country? If and when they amnesty this group of criminals, they will get to bring in family members. In 1967, our population was 200 million. It is now over 300 million. How many can we absorb, 500 million, one billion? Sooner or later we have to close the doors. Do you not care about the quality of life in our country. Do you not care about our countryside being turned into more cities, farmland being chewed up to feed millions of more people? Maybe all you care is about cheap lettuce. One final note, it's cheap for the lettuce, but the other costs are massive. Ask Dani Countryman's family, they paid for your cheap lettuce.

What is a super assault weapon? I think you meant a gun show, not a trade show. Those are two different shows. We have too many gun laws that will prevent most of that crap. Some gun control is ok. No violent criminals, no criminals who used guns in crimes and maybe a few others. No nutcases. No domestic abusers. Semi-automatic weapons with military cosmetic items are OK. No government should regulate those. Large capacity magazines for weapons are OK. Full auto weapons are OK (as long as you can lug it out of the gun show). No indiscriminate weapons like nukes.

Yes I do paint them with a broad brush, remember they broke our laws to get here. They broke our laws to get here. They broke our laws to get here. That is why you find criminal aliens committing such a disproportionate number of crimes. They break our immigration laws, they break our tax laws, they break other MINOR laws. So why in the hell would they give a fuck about any of our laws. If we don't enforce immigration laws, why in the hell would they think we would enforce any other laws?

Do you not care about your fellow Americans' job (if you are an American). Over 533,000 lost their jobs last month, we brought in 140,000 legally into our country. Why do you care more about criminals than your fellow Americans? What about the jobs for children? The criminal aliens have stolen their jobs and educations. It seems as if you hate American, I recommend you move to mexico.

Anonymous said...

Fuck McCain. This is a big reason why he didn't win. Oregon talks about "matters of fairness" all the time. Well, it is unfair for legal immigrants who have waited years to come here and those still waiting, to be by-passed by those who entered illegally, no matter where they come from.

McCain is done.

Also, I don't care if these illegals are not criminals in terms of what they have done or have not done SINCE arriving here. This fucking country is almost broke. My state government wants more money from my ass all the fucking time. It's hard enough as it is. I don't want to pay one goddamned cent that I don't have to pay. Not one fucking cent should go towards illegals other than to pay the price to deport their fucking asses. We could get a lot of self-deportation if we simply forbid these people from entering into contracts, opening bank accounts or getting government services of any kind, but noooooooooooooooooo.

Personally, a lot of these illegals are "cooler" than the uptight whiteys who live in this state. Still, I realize I am stuck with your fucking asses, but why the fuck should we be stuck with these illegal mother fuckers? We shouldn't be. Stop the fucking madness already.

Bobkatt said...

TOH to Robin at the Robin's Nest. For the anon that continuously asked "How's the SAVE Act doing?

Anonymous said...

Kaelri, if you think Miglavs is "forgetting," then you're as naive as he is bigoted. He knows perfectly well how he feels about Latinos ... he just doesn't have the balls to come out and say it, so he hides behind the "illegal alien" banner.

seth said...

daniel its seth this is the only way i have found u so far even after talking with irmali, hit me up man, its been so long..lake oswego man miss ya

Anonymous said...

Miglavs, you disappoint me. I would have thought by now you'd surely post some stupid-ass comment about how all this snow is just more "proof" that global warming is a "lib" fantasy.